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Circulation on the Run


Jul 25, 2022

This week, please join authors Mikhail Kosiborod and Christian Schulze and Editorialist Stefan Anker as they discuss the original articles "Effects of Empagliflozin on Symptoms, Physical Limitations and Quality of Life in Patients Hospitalized for Acute Heart Failure: Results From the EMPULSE Trial" and "Effects of Early Empagliflozin Initiation on Diuresis and Kidney Function in Patients With Acute Decompensated Heart Failure (EMPAG-HF)" and the editorial "SGLT2 Inhibitors: From Antihyperglycemic Agents to All-Around Heart Failure Therapy."

Dr. Carolyn Lam:            

Welcome to Circulation on the Run, your weekly podcast summary and backstage pass to the journal and its editors. We're your co-hosts. I'm Dr. Carolyn Lam, Associate Editor from the National Heart Center and Duke National University of Singapore.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

And I'm Dr. Greg Hundley, associate editor, director of the Pauley Heart Center at VCU Health in Richmond, Virginia.

Dr. Carolyn Lam:            

I'm so excited about the feature discussion this week. It is a paired feature along with their editorial and it's all focused on SGLT2 inhibitors. The first, results from the EMPULSE trial, Effects of Empagliflozin on Symptoms, Physical Limitations and Quality of Life in Patients Hospitalized for Acute Heart Failure; and the second, the EMPAG-heart failure trial, The Effects of Early Empagliflozin Initiation on Diuresis and Kidney Function in Patients with Acute Heart Failure. Incredibly important topics, incredibly important discussion. Wait up for it. We're just going to tell you a little bit more about two other original papers in today's issue, and I'm going to go first, Greg. Is that okay?

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

You bet.

Dr. Carolyn Lam:            

Now, really interesting topic here. We have strong evidence supporting the effective blood pressure and cardiovascular disease risk lowering properties of healthy diet such as the DASH diet, Mediterranean diet, and so on and so on. But what about the diet consumed by a fifth of the entire world's population? The Chinese cuisine. Interestingly, today's paper addresses just that. This is from authors, Dr. Wu, from Peking University Clinical Research Institute and colleagues who performed a multicenter patient and outcome assessor blind randomized feeding trial among 265 participants with baseline systolic blood pressure of 130 to 159 in four major Chinese cuisines.

And these are the Shandong, Huaiyang, Cantonese, and Szechuan cuisines, and here's how they did it. After a seven day run in period on a control diet matching the usual local diets, participants were randomized to continue with the control diet or the cuisine based Chinese heart healthy diet for another 28 days. The primary outcome was systolic blood pressure. The study developed the first heart healthy Chinese diet that fits Chinese food culture and emphasizes its palatability by involving master shifts in developing the recipes.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

Oh wow. Carolyn, this is really interesting, especially one fifth of the world's population in studying a heart healthy diet. So did it work? I can't wait to hear the results.

Dr. Carolyn Lam:            

Well, the change in systolic and diastolic blood pressure from baseline to the end of the study in the control group was five millimeters mercury and 2.8 millimeters mercury reduction, respectively. The net difference of change between the two groups in systolic and diastolic blood pressure were a reduction of 10 and almost four millimeters mercury, respectively. The effect size did not differ among cuisines, and so in summary, with a patient and assessor blind randomized feeding trial, this study really demonstrated that the blood pressure lowering effect of the Chinese heart health diet could indeed be substantial, and importantly, be compatible with medications while palatable and affordable in Chinese adults with high blood pressure, and so these results support the idea that food is medicine and will give many patients with high blood pressure the confidence to adopt heart healthy diets in their lifestyle treatment.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

Wow, Carolyn, that is really an interesting article. So many of these articles today could all be features in and of themselves. That was just outstanding. Well, my next paper comes to us from the world of preclinical science, and it's from Dr. Sean Wu from Stanford University School of Medicine. So Carolyn, immune checkpoint inhibitors are monoclonal antibodies that are used to activate the immune system against tumor cells. Now, despite their therapeutic benefits, immune checkpoint inhibitors have the potential to cause immune mediated adverse events such as myocarditis, a rare but serious side effect with up to 50% mortality in affected patients. Now histologically, patients with immune checkpoint inhibitor of myocarditis have lymphocytic infiltrates in the heart implicating T-cell mediated mechanisms. However, the precise pathologic immune subsets and molecular changes in immune checkpoint inhibitor myocarditis are unknown.

Dr. Carolyn Lam:            

Wow. So insights into the etiology of these immune checkpoint associated myocarditis cases must be very important. So what did they find?

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

Right, Carolyn? So clonal cytotoxic, TEMRA CD8+ cells were found to be significantly increased in the blood of patients with immune checkpoint inhibitor myocarditis corresponding with an analogous increase in effector cytotoxic CD8+ cells in the blood and hearts of PD-1 deficient mice with myocarditis. These expanded effector CD8+ cells had unique transcriptional changes, including upregulation of the chemokines CCL5, CCL4, and CCL4L2, and they may serve as attractive diagnostic therapeutic targets for reducing life threatening cardiac immune related adverse events in immune checkpoint inhibitor treated cancer patients, and Carolyn, just like so many of our articles, there's a very nice accompanying editorial by Professor Gianluigi Condorelli that also offers an update on current research pertaining to non-systemic steroid therapy to treat immune mediated myocarditis. Well, Carolyn, how about we jump to some of the other articles in the issue?

Dr. Carolyn Lam:            

Oh, you bet, Greg. There's an exchange of letters between Drs. Madias and Knops regarding the article “Efficacy and Safety of Appropriate Shocks and Antitachycardia Pacing in Transvenous and Subcutaneous Implantable Defibrillators: The Analysis of All Appropriate Therapy in the PRAETORIAN Trial.”

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

And also in the mail bag, Professor Mark has a Research Letter entitled “Effect of Empagliflozin on Kidney Biochemical and Imaging Outcomes in Patients with Type 2 Diabetes, or Prediabetes, and Heart Failure with Reduced Ejection Fraction, The SUGAR-DM-HF Study,” and our own Tracy Hampton has several synopses from articles published elsewhere in our piece on cardiovascular news. Well, how about we get onto that feature forum discussion, two papers, two editorialists. I can't wait.

Dr. Carolyn Lam:            

Me too. Let's go, Greg.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

Welcome, listeners to this July 26th feature forum discussion. So remember, listeners, for forum discussions, we have several manuscripts that focus on a singular topic and we bring together the authors, our associate editors, and also an editorialist, and today, I want to introduce, we have with us Dr. Mikhail Kosiborod from Mid America Heart Institute in Kansas City, Missouri, Dr. Christian Shults from University Hospital Jena in Germany, Stefan Anker from Charité in Berlin, Germany, and our Associate Editors, Brendan Everett from Brigham and Women's Hospital in Boston, Massachusetts, and Justin Grodin from University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center in Dallas, Texas. Welcome, gentleman, and we'll start with you, Mikhail. Could you describe for us the background information that went into the preparation of your study and what was the hypothesis that you wanted to address?

Dr. Mikhail Kosiborod:  

Well, thanks very much, Greg. The background for the study, which was the secondary analysis of the EMPULSE trial was patients that are hospitalized with acute decompensated heart failure represent a very high risk group. We know that they have high risk of death and hospitalizations, and we also know that they have very poor health status that's very high burden of symptoms, physical limitations, and poor quality of life, and so addressing those treatment goals, trying to reduce the risk of clinical events like death and hospitalizations and improve the symptoms and physical limitations in this patient population are very important treatment goals.

Now we previously demonstrated in the main results of the EMPULSE trials that using empagliflozin initiating empagliflozin SGLT2 inhibitor in this patient population as compared with placebo provided a significant total clinical benefit, which was a composite of total death, repeat hospitalizations for heart failure, or a change in a Kansas City cardiomyopathy questionnaire, which is a kind of a gold standard measure of patient's health status. What we tried to do in a much more granular fashion in this study is to understand the effects of empagliflozin as compared with placebo on this very important outcome, the Kansas City cardiomyopathy questionnaire, and we actually evaluate all of the key domains and composite symptoms, physical limitations, as well as quality of life.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

Very nice, and Mikhail, can you describe for us what study population specifically, and then what was your study design?

Dr. Mikhail Kosiborod:  

Well, this was a population of patients that were hospitalized with heart failure and that EMPULSE was unique in its design because first of all, previous SGLT2 inhibitor trials mostly focused on patients with chronic heart failures that were in an outpatient setting, including prior trials of empagliflozin, and EMPULSE really focused on acutely hospitalized patient population, but it included patients regardless of ejection fraction. So as they were hospitalized with decompensated heart failure and reduced or preserved ejection fraction. They were enrolled regardless of if they had type 2 diabetes, they were enrolled essentially, regardless of kidney function, only patients with EGFR of less than 20 were excluded, and also importantly, was this study and a unique feature of the study in particular was that we enrolled patients whether they had acute de novo heart failure.

That means that was a new diagnosis of heart failure that was bad enough for them to be hospitalized or worsening chronic heart failure requiring hospitalization. So it was really an all-comer trial for patients acutely hospitalized for heart failure. So we had just over 500 patients and they were randomized in the hospital. After a brief period of stabilization, we use empagliflozin, 10 milligrams daily or placebo and treated for 90 days, and the primary outcome at 90 days was a total clinical benefit that I described that was a composite, hierarchical composite of total death hospitalizations, repeat hospitalizations for heart failure and changing KCCQ. In this study, again, we focused predominantly on KCCQ, trying to understand the effects on health status, again, symptoms, physical limitations, and quality of life.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

Excellent. And Mikhail, what were your study results?

Dr. Mikhail Kosiborod:  

Well, what we observed, a couple of things. One is we first examined the effects of empagliflozin on the primary endpoint across the range of KCCQ and baseline, and what we found was that regardless of the degree of symptomatic impairment and baseline, empagliflozin was consistent in providing them total clinical benefits that I described previously, and then kind of shifting to what I think is the most interesting findings, the effects of empagliflozin versus placebo on KCCQ, what we found was that as you would imagine in this population of patients that were acutely hospitalized with heart failures, that had very poor health status, very low KCCQ at baseline, and within the first 90 days, which was observation period, both groups of patients had substantial improvements in KCCQs. As one would expect after acutely decompensated episode of heart failure and treatment in a hospital, everyone got better.

But patients treated with empagliflozin had significantly greater improvement in KCCQs than those that were treated with placebo, and that was first of all, a very substantial difference between the two groups. It was more than five points in favor of empagliflozin already at 15 days and was highly statistically significant, and it was maintained throughout the 90 day treatment period. So the fact that we saw both a clinical meaningful and statistically significant improvement in just 15 days, I think is a very important clinical message, and then finally, I guess what I will mention is these benefits of empagliflozin while main outcome we looked at was KCCQ total symptoms, we're focusing on the symptoms, but it was consistent when we looked at physical limitations as well as quality of life. So really, all key domains of KCCQ were impacted in a similar way.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

Very nice. So in acute heart failure, marked symptomatic improvement after the administration of the SGLT2 inhibitor empagliflozin at 10 milligrams per day. Well, now listeners, we're going to turn to our associate editor, Dr. Brendan Everett, and Brendan, again, you have many papers come across your desk. What attracted you to this particular manuscript?

Dr. Brendan Everett:     

Well, thanks, Greg, and I think this manuscript caught my eye because of the importance of the clinical question, and Mikhail outlined why I think that was really relevant. So we understand that this class of medications or SGLT2 inhibitors have important effects on outcomes like re-hospitalization in patients with heart failure, and what was particularly striking about this paper is that it took patients rather than those with chronic heart failure, but as Mikhail mentioned, enrolled a patient population that was actually in the hospital, and I think this was an important frontier for this particular question about when to start the SGLT2 inhibitor and what kind of benefits there might be. Furthermore, I think the fact that they did not select the population based on ejection fraction was particularly striking, and of course, I think is remarkable, but now old news, they did not select on the presence or absence of diabetes as well.

And so those three components really attracted me to the paper. I also think the outcome is one that really is valuable and worth exploring, and specifically, I'm talking about how patients feel on the medication after a hospitalization for heart failure. Appropriately, we focused on re-hospitalization for heart failure and cardiovascular death in prior trials in this space, and I think we need to embellish those findings or further deepen those findings with a perspective on how patients actually feel when they get the medication, and of course, it goes without saying that what's particularly important here also is that it was a randomized placebo controlled trial, and so the results have some element of internal validity that I think is really important. So those were the things, Greg, that really attracted my attention as I read the paper for the first time.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

Thank you so much, Brendan. Well, listeners, we've got a second paper today and we're next going to hear from Dr. Christian Shults, and he also is focusing on really another aspect of the administration of empagliflozin in patients with acute heart failure and that pertains to the renal function of the patients. So Christian, could you describe for us the background pertaining to your study and what was the hypothesis that you were intending to address?

Dr. Christian Schulze:    

Thanks, Greg. Well, it's great to introduce all study here in this running. So our study impacted those in acute decompensated heart failure. The impact HF trial was a study based on the hypothesis that we wanted to test, whether empagliflozin has effects in acute decompensated heart failure, and we focused on the patient population that was not addressed in EMPULSE, patients that came to the ER and needed to be treated right away, and we wanted to know and this was our main hypothesis, but are the diuretic and [inaudible 00:17:11] effects of the SGLT2 inhibitor on this case, empagliflozin, actually had an impact on diuretic regimens and kidney functions since this is one of the main end points that limits treatment, and also is one of the outcomes of patients with acute decompensated heart failure in the hospital.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

Very nice. And so Christian, what study design did you implement and who was included in your study population?

Dr. Christian Schulze:    

So we also used the randomized two arm study design. We included patients with acute decompensated heart failure independent of left ventricular ejection fraction. Patients needed to have an NT-proBNP of more than 500. The average NT-proBNP in fact was 4,300 in our entire patient population, and we included patients within 12 hours of presentation. So many of these patients have been recruited in the ER, they presented two hour cardiology heart failure service, and then were immediately randomized to the trial in the two arms, and we tested not 10 milligrams of empagliflozin. We actually tested 25 milligrams of empagliflozin based on in-house data that 25 milligrams potentially had a stronger diuretic effect compared to 10 milligrams.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

And what did you find?

Dr. Christian Schulze:    

So we followed patients for five days. It was a relatively short period of time. It was designed to address the in-house phase of patients with acute decompensated heart failure. The mean duration of stay was 6.3 days in the hospital so this was exactly the time that we wanted to test. We had a 30 day endpoint for safety issues, and what we could see is that patients on 25 milligrams on empagliflozin on top of standard diuretic regimens and medical care had 25% higher diuretic outputs compared to patients in the placebo group. We also found no differences in markers of renal injury dysfunction, and could in fact confirm that after 30 days, patients in the empagliflozin group had a better EGFR compared to patients in the placebo group. On top, we saw a more rapid decrease in body weight and also a more profound decrease in NT-proBNT values.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

And Christian, just for our listeners to put a little bit of this in perspective, what was the range of serum creatinine for the patients that were enrolled in your study?

Dr. Christian Schulze:    

So the main EGFR in the entire population was around 60 and the creatinine values were around 107 on average in the entire cohort. So this is a very typical population. We had around 30% of the population with de Novo heart failure, around 20 to 30% of the population was pre-treated for preexisting heart failure. So very typical population of patients with heart failure presenting to the emergency room.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

And did you have any kind of lower level EGFR cutoff, I mean, for enrollment into this study?

Dr. Christian Schulze:    

So when we designed the trial, we actually still had the sub classification of diabetes or impaired glucose or homeostasis as an inclusion criteria. We dropped it before we started the trial because the data came out that this is actually, in fact, not a critical issue for patients with heart failure. So diabetes was not a subgroup in our trial and the lower limit of EGFR was actually a thoroughly defined protocol.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

Very nice. Well, listeners, now we're going to turn to our second associate editor, Dr. Justin Grodin from University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center in Dallas, Texas, and Justin, similar to Brendan, and you see many papers come across your desk and so what attracted you to this particular paper by Christian and his colleagues?

Dr. Justin Grodin:           

Well, Greg, I think first and foremost, and I think very similar to Brendan, but I think what's always striking is if I may just take a step back, decompensated heart failure in the United States is the number one cause for hospitalization among Medicare beneficiaries. So I think really, the brunt and really the truly public health message of the disease is very important in the applicability, and even though that decompensated heart failures is one of the most common things that we ever encounter when we practice, internists, cardiologists, et cetera, we have very, very little clinical trial guidance that tells us how to decongest individuals when they're hospitalized with swelling and heart failure and a lot of these individuals can be quite ill, and we have some clinical trial data, but largely, we have a lot of negative studies or inconclusive studies in this space.

So certainly, what drew me to this trial was definitely that context, and obviously, based on the mechanistic data with SGLT2 inhibitors, I think one of the natural questions, which Christian addresses, is that we know that up front, they do augment natriuresis. So I think it's very compelling to marry those two together because this is what many of us that use these medications regularly have been asking is whether or not they would have some efficacy in that regard, and then another thing that caught my eye and me as a cardiorenal investigator was, just as Christian highlighted, was we have a clinical trial that randomly assigned individuals, really that were ill and many of whom were not stabilized within 12 hours of presentation, and we're talking about patients that are coming into the hospital at all times during the day in and I think that's very remarkable that we have something with standard...

We have a study with standardized assessments where we're really trying to ask a very practical, pragmatic question, which is do these therapies lower the sodium balance in individuals with decompensated heart failure, and I think what's important is largely, we've got a lot of medications that supplement loop diuretics, which are the class of drugs that the majority of us use, and we have a lot of other therapies that we use that really have very little data or poor data that guide us such as thiazide diuretics, carbonic and hydrase inhibitors, mineralocorticoid receptor antagonists, and so here, we have a clinical trial that asks a question that's on many people's minds.

And then we do have very compelling, at least short term pragmatic and mechanistic data that does tell us that these individuals do have a greater natriuretic effect when empagliflozin is used as an adjunct to standardized loop diuretic therapy. So it's a very practical clinical question, and I think what's very important, and we could debate probably all day about the implications of GFR change and kidney function change while we're decongesting somebody with diuretics, but I think what's reassuring to all the clinicians is we really didn't see an effect on kidney function despite a greater natriuretic effect or enhanced diuretic effect, if you will, with the use of empagliflozin.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

Very nice. Well, thank you, Justin. Listeners, now we have an editorialist and as you know, editorialists really help us put the scientific presentation of an original manuscript into the perspective of really the global theme of a topic, and we have Stefan Anker from Berlin, and Stefan, can you describe for us how do we put these two manuscripts and results that we've heard about really in the context now of moving forward with the use of SGLT2 inhibitors in the management of patients with acute decompensated heart failure?

Dr. Stefan Anker:           

Thank you so much. Really, I think these two papers, on the one hand, enhance our certainty about early use, and on the other hand, possibly show us that there might be even more to achieve by, on the one hand, moving even earlier with the application of SGLT2 inhibitors or possibly consider the higher dose. Now let's take one step back. These drugs were developed in type two diabetes and the first successful trial was the [inaudible 00:25:42] outcome trial. Many people have forgotten that this trial tested two doses and not only one, the 10 and the 25 milligram dose, and of course, with the success for improving kidney outcomes and heart failure hospitalization outcomes, we move forward into these two specialist areas, on the one hand, broadening it to the non-diabetic communities, but on the other end, narrowing it by focusing on the 10 milligram dose regardless of whether there is [inaudible 00:26:12].

And we basically now learn A, to use these drugs even earlier than we did in the big trials and we can now be sure to start their use in the hospital, and if you take the average change in quality of life results seen, you actually get a better result for the patient on quality of life when you start earlier than when you start late in the ambulatory studies where basically, in the chronic setting, maybe you have one and a half to two points difference. Here, you now have four and a half points in the study shown by Mikhail, and of course, it's also good to know that you can start this in any type of patient, regardless of their quality of life. The impact study from Christian, they basically moved it now even earlier, moving into the hospital space is possible based on EMPULSE. Moving it into the acute admission space is at least a consideration now based on what Christian here has shown.

And he is actually addressing the one question I hear very often in my presentations about SGLT2 inhibitors, what about this 25 milligram dose? Is there a place for this in cardiology as well, and a possible place is shown here, not only that this is a safe thing to do, but also you get urinary output. Of course, we may in the future, want to see this compared, directly compared to the 10 milligram dose, but of course, the world is not created in one day, but needs more than one and so really, I think these two studies, on the one hand, address an important issue, when to start using them. On the other hand, show us a little bit of a glimpse to the future.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

Very nice, Stefan, and listeners, we get to take advantage of having these authors, editors, and editorialists together and ask them what they see as the next study to be performed in this sort of sphere of research. So Mikhail, we'll start with you. In 30 seconds or less, what do you see as the next study to be performed in this arena of research?

Dr. Mikhail Kosiborod:  

I think, Greg, what we've learned recently, including from the EMPULSE trial, we have this population of patients in a hospital with heart failure's a huge issue as Justin mentioned, and until recently, we had very little [inaudible 00:28:31] for them beyond the usual kind of decongestion with loop diuretics and trying to make them feel better, but you look at outcome data. It really was a dearth of effective therapies that have meaningful impact on important outcomes. Now that's changing, SGLT2 inhibitors is one example. There are some other recent examples in this patient population, like a firm HF and iron deficient patients with heart failure.

But the bottom line is it's no longer kind of a desert, if you will, of positive trials. We now have something we can do and I think what this proves is that we need to actually invest more, both in terms of resources and time to really do what we we're being able to do in other areas of heart failure and those patients with chronic, half and half where we can start developing pillars of therapy that can actually truly improve outcomes with this patient population and there is a lot going on that makes me optimistic that's going to be the case in the coming years.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

Very nice. And Brendan?

Dr. Brendan Everett:     

Well, I think both trials mentioned today really pushed our understanding of this population forward. I think the biggest clinical question that I face when I'm caring for these patients is that we have four, at least, guideline directed therapies, right? We have beta blockers, we have ARBs, ACE inhibitors and ARNIs. We have mineral receptor antagonists and we have SGLT2 inhibitors. So which do we use in what order and how do we start them, and what kind of parameters do we use to guide us if we're limited either by renal function or by blood pressure or by some other factor.

And we often, if not always, have one of those constraints that we're dealing with and so I would say the next step for me is trying to sort out which of these therapies and what order ought to be our highest priority for patients with acute decompensated heart failure as we move quickly from the acute decongestion stage towards discharge and a chronic therapy that will then be followed as an outpatient over the ensuing days and months.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

Very nice. And Christian.

Dr. Christian Schulze:    

Thank you again, and Brandon pointed out very nicely. I mean, we have good evidence now for chronic heart failure treatment. We have the four columns of heart failure medical therapy. Questions that remain open is what do we do with all these patients that are now guideline medicated, come to the hospital with an acute decompensation? Should we carry on with the medication? Should we terminate and in particular, should be carry on with full dose, 50% dose of SGLT2 inhibitors, and the next question is, what dose should we use, in fact, for SGLT2 inhibitors? Is it in group effects or is sotagliflozin comparable to empagliflozin, and then is there a role for a step by scheme that we initially have in high dose therapy that we then downgrade to 10 milligrams on the chronic heart failure treatments, and then of course, quality of life is very important. We should ask this question also in this patient population that is early on treated, do we see benefits that carry on in the outpatient setting and do we see an effect of early treatment on long term benefits?

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

Justin?

Dr. Justin Grodin:           

Well, I would have to agree with all of my colleagues here on this call. I think all have raised really good points, but I think one very simple, and I'll echo some of Brendan's statements, but one very simple question is we know that when we decongest people and initiate a negative salt balance in the hospital for decompensated heart failure, we cause neurohormonal activation and there are a lot of downstream untoward effects from chronic decongestive therapies, and I think one of the more compelling things is we still yet have defined what is the best way to decongest individuals with swelling or volume overload in the hospital. Here, we have compelling studies with SGLT2 inhibitors for quality of life and really, the way patients feel.

And this is really what's important to them, and then something very pragmatic to clinicians and let's make people pee more, but I think one of the compelling questions, and I don't know if it will be answered, is we have a lot of choices for supplemental therapies and different diuretic strategies when patients come in the hospital for decompensated heart failure, and I do think that these studies do move the needle with SGLT2 inhibitors. I think that's abundantly clear, but we still don't know what is the best way to dry out my patient or make my patient pee so that they feel better, but I do think that these studies do at least set the stage that there's some compelling advantages to SGLT2 inhibitors.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

And then lastly, Stefan.

Dr. Stefan Anker:           

Thank you. Besides the detailed points mentioned by many, and Christian, totally support 25 versus 10 milligram, how long 25 milligram, if at all in the future. Besides this, I'm interested in the big picture question. So what about the post myocardial infarct congestion/heart failure situation, and there will be two trials in the next 18 to 24 months that report on this, and my pet kind of area is actually to treat heart failure where nobody thinks it is heart failure, and what I mean is for instance, advanced cancer patients, cardiac wasting cardiomyopathy. So the heart failure in sick cancer patients, and indeed, we are planning to do exactly that now in a study focusing on hospice care patients to really improve the quality of life, the very thing focus here on the EMPULSE trial.

Dr. Greg Hundley:          

Well, listeners, we want to thank our authors, Dr. Mikhail Kosiborod from Mid America Heart Institute in University of Missouri, and Christian Shults from the University Hospital in Jena, Germany. Also, our associate editors, Dr. Brendan Everett from Brigham and Women's Hospital in Boston, and Dr. Justin Grodin from University of Texas Southwestern in Dallas, Texas, and also, our editorialist, Dr. Stefan Anker from Charité in Berlin, Germany for bringing us these two manuscripts pertaining to two randomized clinical trials regarding the administration of the SGLT2 inhibitor, empagliflozin in acute heart failure, demonstrating first, marked improvement in heart failure symptoms and health related quality of life.

And second, in those with estimated GFRs greater than 30 mls per minute, an augmentation of natriuresis in the setting of the co-administration of diuretics without deterioration in renal function. Well, on behalf of Carolyn and myself, we want to wish you a great week and we will catch you next week on the run. This program is copyright of the American Heart Association, 2022. The opinions expressed by speakers in this podcast are their own and not necessarily those of the editors or of the American Heart Association. For more, please visit ahajournals.org.